Wellow Abbey in Grimsby Lincolnshire ~ A Medieval Investigation
Wellow Abbey in Lincolnshire was a house for the Austin Canons and was founded in Grimsby in the early1100s.
It sat on a hill in grounds in the area that is now in and around the Abbey Drive, Abbey Park Road area.
The Augustinian monastery or priory is both of great interest and importance and the aim of this article is to amass as much historical information as possible
If you can add to the sum of that knowledge then please do leave a comment
Although I’ve been unable to find an exact date the the formation of Abbey of Wellow it was founded by King Henry I ( c. 1068/1069 – 1 December 1135 ) so that makes a date circa 1130s not ridiculous. There is a Royal Charter dating 1155-1162 which mentions gifts made to the abbey
The house was dedicated to St. Augustine and St. Olaf and situated (see map further down) on a hill in the centre of Grimsby not far from St James Church. It was supplied with fresh water from a spring situated at the side of the hill. The spring was of sufficient strength to power a water mill which stood at the foot of the hill.
The surrounding lands and tithes made the monastery quite healthy financially with a recorded income of over £152 per annum.
During the time of the Dissolution of the Monasteries by Henry VIII their assets, in 1539, amounted to some 700 acres of land as well as manors, tithes, various properties rented out and mills.
the Original Seals of Wellow Abbey
Above you’ll see images of the two surviving seals. The one on the left (2) is circa 1369 and the figure represents Saint Augustine.
The right-hand seal is finer and is believed roughly the same date.
The original site is believed to have had Pagan Origins and the stones, allegedly formed in a circle with one large standing stone, formed part of the foundations of the abbey itself.
According to an archaeological report ‘worked stones’ were found at TA 2690 0875 along with burials to the east at TA 2695 0875 during the construction of houses.
A Map Showing the Main Religious Buildings
in Grimsby During the Medieval Period
The Abbot of Wellow would have been a very powerful man locally, a large landowner and no doubt keen to avariciously extend the Abbey’s holdings and income.
This lead them into conflict with the newly powerful Burgesses / Freemen of Grimsby not to mention going into competition with The Knights Templar in the blocking of roads with gates (hence Bargate et al) in order to secure tolls from travellers and traders.
Court records and petitions are plentiful from the 1200s as the Augustinian House sought to protect their holding and assets from the Burgesses of the town.
I should be particularly interested to flesh out more of the later history of the site. Dissolution brought about the end of the building in 1539 but what happened to it after that ?
One final thought, I wonder whether this is the source of the stone I have
I understand some very low level remains were still visible in the 1960s and, tantalizingly, there is an aerial photograph in existence taken in 1947 which shows some of the remains - I should dearly love to locate that !
Likewise a picture of the Abbey of Wellow, thus far I’ve failed to find anything, perhaps there is none though I’d like to think there is - can you help ?
I’ll draw this to an initial conclusion now but please do read on as I, and hopefully others, will expand this article in greater depth, and with new material as and when it comes to light, in the comments below.
If you know of anything at all then please do leave any comments or opinions - all are very welcome.
All the best
Rod
Please scroll down and check the comments as there is a great deal more information coming to lighht in them - thank you
Amiguru said,
May 11, 2010 @ 6:55 pm
This image shows Grimsby with an obviously ecclesiastical building, and over to the east, ‘a chappell’. A tentative revised date for this hand-painted map is 1555-60. On the basis of that suggested time bracket, it might well be assumed that the main building is St. James church as St. Mary’s was by then in ruins and probably partly demolished and Wellow Abbey had been dissolved in 1536.
I am going to suggest that it might be Wellow Abbey on the following premises.
1. The map shown is from an atlas produced for William Cecil 1st. Baron Burghley.
William Cecil was born in Bourne Lincolnshire in 1520 and was “the chief advisor of Queen Elizabeth I for most of her reign.”
One of the devises he always carried with him as Secretary of State was an atlas which he used when referring to the various issues at hand. The atlas was produced for him by Lawrence Nowell and must predate 1595, (which is the previous date I supplied to Rod along with the original image on the ‘whale’ thread), as by then Nowell was dead.
Laurence Nowell (c. 1515 – c. 1571) was, among other things, an antiquarian and a cartographer. Wikipedia states that:
“Nowell devoted much effort in the 1560s to a large-scale atlas of Anglo-Saxon Britain, though he never completed the work. For Cecil, he made the first accurate cartographic survey of the East coast of Ireland, as well as a small, accurate pocket-sized map of Britain, which Cecil always carried with him.”
2. There was a commission to “take depositions respecting the abbey of Wellow” in 1581. There must obviously have still been at that date some remains of the abbey.
3. If the date range which I suggest for the map is reasonably accurate, then although we can’t now know what Nowell based his map on, - maybe first hand travel or possibly on information obtained from others - then certain stylistic principles may come into play. Whatever his source, the image, although it looks a bit like St James’ with a spire, is more likely to follow the practice of indicating ranked importance which seems to have been the style of this and other maps of those times.
Added to that, even if the image was a realistic representation of the building represented, it would, by the time he produced the maps, have been ‘as was’.
I would now like to move to another source for the evidence which triggered these thoughts.
Bishop Alnwick of Lincoln made a visitation of the monastery of Wellow by Grimsby, in 1440 and the Abbot and bretheren were encouraged to account for themselves and the state of affairs in the abbey as well as being allowed to make complaints.
“Frater Johannes Bachilere dicit quod habetur vna cantaria apud Holme cui deseruitur quotidie per duos canonicos ibidem residentes.”
which translates as:
“Brother John Bachilere says that they have a chantry at Holme, which is served daily by two canons who reside in the same.”
Further, Brother John Alesby complains that “he serves the church of Clee in the office of parish chaplain, and desires to be restored to cloister ; for every day he comes to the monastery for his meals, which is toilsome, but he spends the night at Clee.”
‘Holme’ is the old name for Clee and it is this name that rang a bell, (pause for groan), in relation to the ‘chappell’ in the map!
St. James is now, as the Grimsby Parish Church, arguably, the most important religious building in the town but, back in the 16th. century would not Wellow, despite the dissolution having been implemented, have been of primary importance as a symbolic image? If the map was created based on older documents, images or memories then Wellow as the Mother establishment of St. James’ may well have still held sway.
There I must rest my case and invite others to comment on these thoughts. If you have got this far then at least I have not bored you too much.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 11, 2010 @ 7:51 pm
Neville,
truly fascinating and I see much in what you say - I’ll make a couple of random points that come to mind after having read your comment.
St. James is now, as the Grimsby Parish Church, arguably, the most important religious building in the town but, back in the 16th. century would not Wellow, despite the dissolution having been implemented, have been of primary importance as a symbolic image?
This is interesting as establishing hierarchy is clearly important. I felt sure I’d read somewhere that the Abbey was ‘given to’ St James - however another snippet which I’ve been able to check is about the church falling into disrepair and losing its aisles - this was blamed on ‘the constant neglect of the Abbots of Wellow under whose jurisdiction the church had been placed’
By definition then, the church was clearly presumed to be their responsibility
I would agree with you that clearly the symbolic significance of the illustration means there is more importance attached to that building than some others shown on the map.
That would certainly fit with it being an ‘Abbey’ rather than a ‘Church’
But just to offer other ideas:
St James is described, before it lost the aisles etc, as being a very impressive building in fact ‘cathedral like in appearance’
Perhaps that would account for the grandiose image ?
Or . . .
What if the image is indeed an amalgamation of Lawrence Nowell’s ideas / memory / information / impression ?
Perhaps the image represents both St James and Wellow Abbey - they are after all virtually next door.
Also to that, and for devilment, if looked at from the angle on the map they may actually have appeared thus with the abbey obscuring all but the church spire - they may have looked as one building from that angle.
Very interesting stuff indeed Neville and a fabulous piece of deductive suggestion
The map is succulent as well
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 11, 2010 @ 9:31 pm
Rod,
Good questions and points. I will even go as far as offering possible evidence against my suggestion, in as much as I seem to recall reading somewhere that St. James once had a short spire. I really must try and find that again, if it exists. I’ll sleep on your suggestions as I’ve done about 12 hours research today and am in overload.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 12, 2010 @ 6:44 am
Neville,
further to my suggestion that it could be a pastiche image - imagine that spot once.
In a very small area you had St James church of ‘cathedral appearance’ St Mary’s church which was supposed to be even more impressive plus the abbey itself all in a very small area.
Given the size of the town and the number of inhabitants it must of been quite something to see - I can imagine it in my mind - incredible.
It was certainly an important religious centre, records of the Burgesses state that people were discouraged from settling in the town because of the cost of upkeeping the churches, abbey and priories etc.
There was a lot going on in a small area
Amiguru said,
May 12, 2010 @ 9:51 pm
Rod,
Have just spent the last two hours or so poring over nearly 200 maps of Lincolnshire of many centuries and at various scales looking at the representations of Grimsby and environs. There is one map that I think may exist dated 1537 which could answer all of these questions if I can find it.
In the meantime, I am going to e-mail you the Lincolnshire portion of the Gough map in case you haven’t seen it at large enough scale to identify places, which is difficult to find. It is a sheer joy to peruse, oh and for anyone not familiar with it, it is the oldest road map of Britain dating from about 1360! The challenge is to find Grimsby
Did I send a copy of the Bates map of Grimsby yet Rod? That shows the Abbey remains at that point in time.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 13, 2010 @ 9:16 am
Neville,
The Gough map is mouthwatering Neville !
You did indeed send me the Bates map - 1893, I’ve got it on file - many thanks
All the best
Rod
Simon said,
May 13, 2010 @ 4:35 pm
I’m pretty sure I’ve seen pictures of the Wellow abbey in the local (Grimsby) reference library, in the ‘local studies’ section, it was a little while ago now, and I didnt take notes, but I’m fairly sure there are pics to be seen there.
I’m personally of the opinion that the building in the map is St James, I think it has been established so long, and is on such a grand scale that it would have been a very important building at that time. Am I right to say that some of the St Marys stone was used to rebuild part of St James? I must dig out my notes about it.
Simon
Simon said,
May 13, 2010 @ 4:55 pm
I meant to say too, that I doubt an abbey would have had a spire, rather the abbey church (in this case St James) would have had a spire.
Rod said,
May 13, 2010 @ 8:12 pm
Hi Simon,
thanks for the comment and welcome to the site - hope you’ll return.
I’ll have to check the reference library - many thnaks for the tip-off
I believe you’re right and that some of the stone was indeed used at St James’
As to the spire Simon I’m sure Neville wasn’t suggesting it had one more referring to the picture as being symbolic rather than a representation of the actual building.
Thanks again Simon and . . . dig out those notes
All the best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 13, 2010 @ 8:50 pm
Simon,
Re the spire; I concur with what Rod has just said. I just tend to think aloud and suggest different options and feasibilities. I acknowledge that it is not always a scientific approach to investigating what may have been, but it does encourage others to come back at my suggestions, possibly discount them and offer alternatives. Cats and pigeons come to mind
Welcome aboard as I know Rod likes lots of input from as many people as possible. I’m sure lots of people read and pass by but it is so much more interesting to see different angles on things.
Kind regards,
Neville
Simon said,
May 14, 2010 @ 3:07 pm
Thanks, and sorry for the misunderstanding
I am particularly interested in monasticism and its heritage, I’ve a book about ‘new monasticism’ coming out in the autumn, and have pondered a book about the monastics locally, hence my short trip to the library a while back.
I keep this site on my reader, and will keep an eye on any other updates.
Cheers, S.
History Hunter said,
May 19, 2010 @ 10:34 pm
Sir Rodders of Whyburgh, i have recently visited Grimsby Reference Library on the hunt for any representations of aforementioned Wellow Abbey. Well after searching through a stack of photos, and also talking to the staff there, that they have nothing visual relating to the original Wellow Abbey.
But i have found quite a few photos of The Abbey, later built on the site of Wellow Abbey, which was eventually knocked down in 1965. I did read who owned the house, but i have forgotten now. Curiously there are a few photos that show excavations within the gardens, with many carved and ornate stones having been unearthed. Whether there are any records of it at the Archaeology Dept. at the council i do not know.
I have also found a photo that was in the local Bygones paper showing the positioning of The Abbey. I have correlated the photo against modern day Google Maps and have pinpointed exactly where it was situated.
If you require more details, and would like to see the photo/google positioning i can send you it for inclusion on here.
As a addendum, one of the reference library staff said she would contact somebody at the Council on my behalf and ask if they have any more details available.
Rod said,
May 20, 2010 @ 7:57 am
HH,
now that’s cracking stuff - very interesting indeed. Shame there’s no picture but interesting info on the later build.
I wonder what happened to that stone ?
Is the photo from Bygones and old aerial photo HH - taken in 1947 as I know it was once in there and I can’t find it elsewhere ?
Great detective work HH - really is appreciated
Best
Rod
Peter Mullins said,
May 20, 2010 @ 2:16 pm
I’ve been in Germany for a week so may have missed out on all sorts of interesting strands. I too have been disappointed with how little the local history section at the Library has about Wellow Abbey. But it is quite clear where it stood (on the rise around which Abbotsway circles) and the archeological references to burials above come from things like discoveries during house extensions in what must have been the burial place near the Abbey building.
Now Augustinians were not originally strictly monks but rather Canons (colleges of priests who lived together and often went out to serve a local churches or parishes - much as the priests of Saxon Minsters did). The Nun’s Corner community was also strictly a house of Augustininan Canonesses ratherv than nuns. Originally they had a Provost not an Abbot, but over the years the distinction was lost and they became just another community of monks and started using the terms Abbot and Abbey.
The earliest English writing in Lincolnshire (and unique guide to how English was spoken is the twelfth century) is the Ormulum - the writings of a Canon called Orm from the Augustinian Bourne Abbey where he tried to retell or explain each week’s Latin Gospel reading so that the locals who spoke no Latin or French could understand it. This shows clearly their involvement with the local churches.
Anyway, the link with St James and with Clee above is that these appear to have been churches served from Wellow Abbey - there is even a late directive from the Bishop saying that in future Clee shouldn’t be served from Wellow but should have its own resident priest. I don’t know whether or not this also explains why the knight’s effigy from Nun’s Corner ended up in St James.
Rod said,
May 20, 2010 @ 7:43 pm
Peter,
welcome back to the Fair Shire !
There’s some very intersting information there Peter many thanks.
History Hunter also sent me some related reports from the redoubtable Hugh at NELC today of which there are some snippets below
Cemetery to St Augustine and St Olaf Abbey, Wellow
Human remains discovered during the erection of an extension.
Human remains found at TA2 6950 875 during house construction).
Further human remains found during extension at number 15 Lambert Road Grimsby
As burials are to the south of religious buildings this would suggest that abbey was in the Abbey Drive and Abbots Way as they are today.
History Hunter said,
May 21, 2010 @ 12:34 am
If you want to see the photos i mentioned Rod, ask in the reference library for the box numbered G727:728
Amiguru said,
May 21, 2010 @ 8:09 pm
Back in the early 60’s I used to get the bus to Grimsby, then walk to work at Peoples Park and my route included Abbey Park West.
I was familiar with the Victorian building which stood in the abbey grounds and accepted the demolition of it with no great concern as it was not a particularly edifying building by then.
Work progressed and once the rubble had been cleared a bulldozer was brought in to level the site for development.
On one particular morning I looked through a gap in the hedge slightly damaged by the machinery and there saw a bone sticking out of the churned up soil. I ‘rescued’ it for further examination and soon realised that it was a human right tibia, (shinbone).
It had been broken in half, presumably by the machinery, but was otherwise in quite good condition. Was it a former Abbot’s, or one of the bretheren; who knows?
The Victorian building incidentally was built for a prominent Grimsby family which I can’t recall for certain but I believe may have been the Heneages or the Wintringhams. Laterly, it became the headquarters of the Royal Air Force Association.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 21, 2010 @ 8:13 pm
Neville,
that’s simply fantastic and many thanks for sharing it - pleased to finally get the bone picture up there.
Wouldn’t it be fantastic to know who it belonged to, when they lived and what they did.
I love the idea it belonged to one of the abbots or brothers of Wellow, in fcat unless anyone can prove it didn’t I decree that it was
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 21, 2010 @ 10:51 pm
Rod,
“…….On this resignation, the king…….. by letters patent, gave and granted the Abbey, with all its lands, manors, advowsons, and all other appurtenances to Sir Thomas Heneage and the Lady Katherine his wife, in consideration of the sum of £14: 14s to him paid. The buildings were then demolished;the cemetery and all the monumental stones destroyed, and a farm house was erected on its site. The entire property in Grimsby, Clee and Weelsby, still belong to Mr. Heneage.”
Rev George Oliver DD, in ‘Ye Byrde of Gryme’ 1866 p.139
This is Oliver’s account of the disposal of Wellow Abbey after the resignation and submission of the Abbey to the will of the King in 1539. The emboldening is mine.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 22, 2010 @ 7:51 am
Neville,
that’s a great find, very interesting indeed, worth further investigation. It has struck me that the surprising thing about Wellow Abbey is the lack of information compared to similar places
Brilliant find Neville
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 22, 2010 @ 11:10 am
Rod,
As you have now decreed that the bone is that of one of the bretheren of Wellow, may I now determine that it shall be deemed to be the shin of John Grymesby as I am fairly certain that he would be buried there? I am not leg-pulling
John was at one time the Abbot of Wellow and subsequently resigned, (perhaps due to age or infirmity), as he stayed within the community as witnessed by an injunction issued by Bishop Flemyng in 1422 strictly instructing that:
“……..we enjoin and command you the abbot and your several canons, as above, that brother John Grymesby, now the prior, sometime the abbot of the said monastery, receive and have while his life lasts a seemly chamber, which shall be appointed to him with all other furniture and necessaries fitly belonging to the same, and [receive] in all things from the said monastery double the portion which one canon of the said monastery receives and is wont to receive.”
It would be lovely to imagine him sort of retired and given all the comforts due “while his life lasts” finally to be buried in the Abbey cemetery.
Regards,
Neville
Amiguru said,
May 22, 2010 @ 8:55 pm
Rod,
Interesting spread of bone, the OS ref of HH’s you quote is behind a house on the west of St Olaf’s Drive; my leg came from a spot on the front lawn of No. 13 Abbey Drive West. That is a distance of 87 metres or 95 yards.
Regards,
Neville
Amiguru said,
May 23, 2010 @ 8:55 pm
Rod,
Here is a list of the inmates of Wellow Abbey and their specific roles where applicable at the visitation of the Vicar General, (bishop’s deputy) on 27th. June 1525:
Richard Kyngston abbas
William Yong prior
Robert Wright
Thomas Rosse sacrista
Thomas Lincoln
William Snaythe
Robert Whitgifte*
Johannes Atkynson
WilliamYorke
William Kyrbee
* On Kyngston’s death in 1526 Robert Whitgift,
nephewuncle of the Archbishop of Canterbury, became the Abbot and was in post at the dissolution in 1539.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The day before, the visitation was at Nuncoton so I will now go and list the occupants on that thread.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 24, 2010 @ 8:06 am
Neville,
many thanks, one name there reminds me that I really ought to write up the Whitgifts
Best
Rod
Peter Mullins said,
May 24, 2010 @ 8:34 pm
“On Kyngston’s death in 1526 Robert Whitgift, nephew of the Archbishop of Canterbury, became the Abbot and was in post at the dissolution in 1539″
“Uncle”, surely?
Amiguru said,
May 24, 2010 @ 10:00 pm
Peter,
You’re absolutely right. I spotted that faux pas earlier and intended to post a corrective note but you beat me to it. Apologies to all.
Regards,
Neville
Amiguru said,
May 26, 2010 @ 10:11 pm
Rod,
Today’s reading matter has been about the actual nitty-gritty of what went on locally at the Dissolution and I am quite shocked at the heartless greed and regardless ill treatment of the members of the religious houses who were not necessarily physically harmed but were turfed out and left in despair. Their behaviour may not always have been the best but Henry’s greed, and indeed that which Cromwell ‘creamed off’ was extreme and uncaring in extreme times. Here is just a taster of what went on:
By September 1536 the threat of the storm of dissolution struck for the first time at Louth Park in Lincolnshire “……and the people had witnessed the sales of the ornaments and vestments of the church, which, together with the other effects of the place, realised close upon the large sum of a thousand pounds.” Other houses were not to prove so fruitful, whether because they were warned and proceeded to disperse their assets as indicated in the next paragraph, or whether they were by this stage truly ‘bankrupt’ is hard to discern.
The report that the king was going to take possession of all church plate was fully believed on all sides. ” One William Man that singeth bass in the choir at Louth and parson Sotbye going to board with Thomas Manby at Louth,”…… said, that ” the common fame was that the inhabitants of the town of Hull had sold the church stuff to prevent the king’s commissioners.”
And whilst dining at Grimsby, a sailor, “a very tall man having a tall woman for his wife,” was heard to say: “We hear at Hull that ye should have a visitation here shortly, and therefore we have taken all our church plate and jewels and sold them and paved our town withal.* And so, if ye be wise, will ye do too and mend your town, which is foul withal.”
One of the King’s main agents, Dr. London later that year reported back in a letter to Thomas Cromwell:
“Since that I last was with you, I have received to the king’s use twelve houses of friars: that is, one in Huntingdon, four in Boston, four in Lincoln, one in Grantham, one in Newark and now one in Grimsby. They all were in poverty, and little left, scarce to pay the debts and in some places not so much as £3 or (so). In these houses the king’s grace shall have but the lead, which I think in all twelve houses shall be, ‘as I can judge it, about twelve score fodders or more and twenty-four bells, such as they be ; and of every house a chalice of six to ten ounces apiece, in some places more. These chalices I bear with me, and other silver if I find it.”
* I wonder if this is where the expression ‘the streets were paved with gold’ originates; meaning the precious metals and jewels were sold to pay for the paving of the streets which were notoriously boggy in winter at this time.
Regards from an utterly dissolved,
Neville
Rod said,
May 27, 2010 @ 6:24 am
Neville,
)
fascinating and truly interesting - read it twice in fact (though that could be my age
I should love to get a real snap shot of what life was like back then, hard clearly, but wouldn’t it be fascinating to be bale to step back in time and see it all unfold.
There’s been some raw work done in the past by kings and indeed by the church.
The last point about th eexpression is a good one - be worth looking into how that did come about - you could be right !
Brilliant Neville, a great read, enjoyed it as I’m sure will many others
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 29, 2010 @ 6:54 am
Odd Man Out ~~~~ Gossip of the Day - 2 November 1967
The ‘Grimsby Evening Telegraph’ as it was known in 1967, had had a piece written regularly for many years by ‘Odd Man Out’. For all I know he is at it still, but I haven’t had the time to do that bit of research. OMO wasn’t afraid to speak frankly and was even acerbic at times but at least you knew where he stood. Here is his report on a sad day for Grimsby:
Odd Man Out ~~~~ Gossip of the Day - 2 November 1967
“The bulldozers are moving in at The Abbey, about the last unsavaged historical site left in Grimsby - in the town itself, anyway, if you exclude the church.
The Abbey - by which I mean the house - was an outdated barn of a place, for which few tears will be shed. But the house and the extensive gardens are on the site of the old Abbey of Wellow, and if any spot in Grimsby cried out for archaeological investigation, this was It. It is too late now.
If any site in Grimsby called out for public ownership, it was this too. What an admirable place to have built (after the archaeologists had done their job) a museum, standing in a quiet garden. What a fine spot for any one of a number of possible ventures by the Town Council.
NO REASON
Money is short for such things at the moment? No reason for not acquiring the site for future use. The council of course can say that it tried. When the place was offered at auction, the council’s representatives made their bid. But this, by law, could only go up to the value put upon the place by the District Valuer. If any developer wants a site in such circumstances, he has no difficulty at all in defeating that kind of competition.
What we all know I think, is that the Council could have had the Abbey long ago, if it had not waited until the last minute. If someone had moved soon enough ( why not 10 years ago?) the site could have been protected even if not acquired. The conclusion is inescapable. Grimsby councillors don’t really care a tinker’s cuss about such things. A lot of them are even now probably, rubbing their silly hands at the prospect of all the nice new ratable value the development will represent. And if the councillors don’t care, that means something else - that Grimsby doesn’t care either. Or not enough. It never has. Has the place got a soul at all? One sometimes wonders.”
Have things changed since then regarding council decisions? I don’t know, but what I do know is that ‘once its gone - its gone!’
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
May 29, 2010 @ 7:00 am
Neville,
that’s a fantastic find from your clippings collection - brilliant !
Reading OMO’s words - they could have been written yesterday - indeed the sentiments could have been written by me.
There must be more pictures or postcards out there of the Abbey building ?
Thanks again Neville - incredible as ever
Best
Rod
Rod said,
June 8, 2010 @ 7:17 pm
Wellow Abbey Update:
I’ve been kindly sent a map given to a resident some years ago whose house is situated on Abbey Drive West.
It was given to her by the Borough Surveyor during investigations of subsidence.
The plan shows the abbey location and the surveyor has penned the location of the house onto the map.
The subsidence issue related to the garage - the reason it was happening was explained when it became clear the garage stood on what was once the Abbey Pond !
Location of the Abbey on a Modern Map
Amiguru said,
June 8, 2010 @ 7:23 pm
Rod!
Yahoo!
Neville
Amiguru said,
June 9, 2010 @ 7:10 am
I have taken the 1848 map and coloured in all of the bodies of water, then overlaid that map onto the Googlemap image of the area.
This allows a comparison to be made of the buildings and road layouts between then and now. The ‘abbey’ buildings on the map kindly provided by your new contact today, match very well with those of 1848. Interestingly, the outbuildings to the east have only had slight alterations whilst the main building had, apparently, had ‘wings and turrets’ added between 1848 and 1967.
Regards,
Neville
This is map-merge stage 2. I have now taken the 1848 map and overlayed it with the 1660 map in a manner similar to the above. Of course, the further back we go the more complex the issues are as naturally, surveying methods and representational images improve in their clarity with time.
In the 17th. century for instance, as you see, buildings tended to be represented in a WYSIWIG fashion, (to coin a modern acronym). Despite all of this the 1660 map seems to be reasonably accurate regarding the relative positioning and direction of roads. I have labelled this map to point out some features and make suggestions for others to consider.
There is an important consideration to be born in mind regarding some of the ideas below:
The abbey after its dissolution in 1539 was given to Sir Thomas Heneage, (see my post above dated May 21st. 2010), and he and his successors may well have demolished the abbey buildings in whole or in part, possibly rebuilt parts and added others. Who knows - so far we have no evidence.
Feature A is the abbey mill and as it has been drawn on its side this enables us to determine that it is a water mill and the millwheel can clearly be seen.
B, as the largest of the structures may have been the main building of the abbey or a replacement farmhouse.
C is obviously crenellated and may be part of the original enclosure of the abbey buildings.
D is the location of the modern public house ‘The Wheatsheaf’. Other aids to orientation are the triptych of roads on the upper left which are, to give their modern names, Bargate, Brighowgate and Abbey Road.
E I shall reserve for a later post as it is a seperate issue.
F, I shall suggest, with its appended yard may well belong on the identical spot to G which is a feature of the 1848 map and also has a yard attached. F may be slightly out of position for the topographical reasons given above.
Once again apologies for the long drawn out explanations but I felt it necessary to qualify what I have said. Please feel free to engage with my theories as it is only with discussion that we shall hope to approach the truth.
I have one more ‘magic’ moment to reveal but that will be in a follow-up post
Regards,
Neville
Amiguru said,
June 10, 2010 @ 1:20 pm
When studying the image in my previous post above it suddenly occured to me that there was a positional relationship between the cluster of abbey buildings on the 1660 map and the pond and buildings shown on the 1848 map.
If my premise that the building and yard indicated at ‘F’ is the same as those indicated at ‘G’ but is slightly out of position, then by rotating the whole abbey cluster clockwise by about 60° and shifting it into the 1848 position then the pond fits snugly in the available space within the group.
The two lower buildings, ‘H’ in the group then fit neatly against other water courses rather than on top of them as in the previous map. I don’t know what to make of ‘J’ but it too fits neatly against the curve of the stream at that point. Could it be a crenellated tower or is it an enclosure of some kind?
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
June 10, 2010 @ 1:24 pm
Neville,
that’s tremendous work - could be your finest hour - and there’s plenty of candidates for that title.
Looking at the rotation and what you suggest - it must be right surely - look how it all sites together.
This has really turned into something Neville - every time I come to this one I scroll down it and smile to myself.
Fabulous !
Many thanks
Rod
Amiguru said,
June 10, 2010 @ 2:33 pm
Rod,
Many thanks for the compliment. I know it is not everyone’s ‘cup-of-tea’ but I certainly find it exhilerating getting the most out of that which we inherit. Which reminds me; did you see the ‘Mappa Mundi’ programme on at 7pm last night? If not, I recommend you go and watch it online. It illustrates the sense of entrancement I experience with old maps. They are treasure chests of information, not all of which is evident at first glance.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
June 10, 2010 @ 4:29 pm
No TV watching at all at the moment I’m afraid Neville - don’t even plug the thing in I’ll take a look online
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
June 11, 2010 @ 4:51 pm
Today’s image is part of a request from the Abbot of Wellow, Henry Suttone, (I think), to the King, Henry VI to acquire the Chapel of Clee, (which can be seen near the top of this thread), and all its appurtenances. The usual Latin is no big deal to translate but this document is in post-mediaeval Court French so I hope you will bear with me a little. I also have the king’s reply granting the request, so Hooray Henry! …..to them both
Even to the untrained eye it is quite easy to discern in the middle of the top line the words saying, effectively: ‘The Abbey of Wellow Minster, the Diocese of Nicoll, [French for Lincoln]’, …..and in the second line: ‘esglise de Clee’, [chapel of Clee].
Cordialement,
Neville
Rod said,
June 11, 2010 @ 4:54 pm
Neville,
The usual Latin is no big deal to translate but this document is in post-mediaeval Court French
I quite agree, I was going to translate myself but am just about to nip out for a walk with camera
Seriously, what a thing to see - incredible
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
June 11, 2010 @ 5:10 pm
Rod,
Sorry, forgot to mention it dated 1427.
“about to nip out for a walk with camera”…..cameraderie is what we need
Neville
Amiguru said,
June 16, 2010 @ 3:08 pm
Rod,
More details of the report of the Commission of Enquiry into the state of the Religious dispersed by the Dissolution of Monasteries.
The report gives more details than just the level of pension allotted to those concerned. Some were allocated a pension but seemingly not in receipt of it while others were more fortunate. Some stayed in the vicinity of their former religious house and some indeed, if it was still habitable, and not commandeered, remained there to eke a living as best they could.
Marriage, strictly speaking, had been illegal for them while the Houses existed but during the period of these reports starting in 1540 and running on through the reign of Henry’s son, Edward VI; Queen Mary then Elizabeth the 1st. circumstances changed and it became legal for them to enter into marriage from the Spring of 1549.
Strangely, I can find few extracts relating to the former inmates of Wellow Abbey:
“Pen[sion] Robert Whytegyfte former abbot @ £16 p.a.”
“Sir Robert Lynndellye now v[icar] of Grimsby pen[sion] of £3 of the Queen’s majesty [Eliz. I] for the cure of Wellow.”
The dearth of entries is starkly contrasted by the numbers at St Leonard’s in the town and totally outclassed by the bretheren of Thornton. Details of these I shall give on their appropriate threads.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
June 16, 2010 @ 5:30 pm
Neville,
I wonder why there’s more about St Leonard’s than Wellow - that wel known name Whitgift seems to have had a result at £16, not as good as the man from Newhouse but a considerable sum.
Great stuff this Neville, many thanks
Rod
Mark Brooks said,
June 21, 2010 @ 4:39 pm
Pilgrimage of Grace 1536
Apologies if I going off at a tangent – I’m still learning web etiquette but was delighted to come across your excellent exchange of information. I am trying to establish if the port of Grimsby was functional in 1536, at the time of the Pilgrimage of Grace – it seems from some sources it may have fallen into serious decline by then.
I am also trying to establish if the Port of Ravenspur across the river was operating in 1536.
Again apologies if this rather butting in across another subject but a pointer in the right direction (I am not local – UK Midlands) for additional research on this dramatic period of English history would be much appreciated.
Amiguru said,
June 21, 2010 @ 10:43 pm
Mark,
I’m sure Rod doesn’t mind your enquiries at all. The ethic of this site is for us all to share and learn what we can.
The port of Grimsby had become silted up by the mid 14th. century and the town obtained permission from the king, Edward III to divert the Freshney in order to ‘flush out’ the port’s harbour. This worked for a while but by Henry VII’s reign the Mayor and Burgesses were complaining of a similar problem. Apparently, the large cliff at , what is now Cleethorpes, was being eroded away by natural forces and the resultant debris deposited in the entrance of the port. To answer your first question, I think it is fair to say that it was functional but in a very limited way, apparently only at ’spring tides’.
“Regarding Ravenspurn, Tom Shepherd F.G.S.states in 1909: “After the town of Ravenspurn (which formerly existed at the Humber’s mouth) was washed away by the sea in the fourteenth century, the merchants perforce had to find new homes ; some settled at Grimsby and others went to Kingston-upon-Hull, which in those days was a comparatively small port.”
There was also another settlement close to Ravenspurn called Ravenser Odd and of this Shepherd quotes The Meaux Chronicle In 1346: “When the inundations of the sea and of the Humber had destroyed to the foundations the chapel of Ravenserre Odd, built in honour of the Blessed Virgin Mary, so that the corpses and bones of the dead there buried horribly appeared, and the same inundations daily threatened the destruction of the said town, sacrilegious persons carried off and alienated certain ornaments of the said chapel, without our due consent, and disposed of them for their own pleasure ; except a few ornaments, images, books, and a bell which we sold to the mother church of Esyngton, and two smaller bells to the church of Aldeburghe.”
I think you can say that neither of these two were extant in 1536. Hypotheses about islands in the Humber though are as transient as the islands and sandbanks themselves. Indeed, Spurn Point itself is constantly shifting and has moved a few miles over the last two millenia.
I hope that is all of use, and I’m sure others will want to add to it.
Regards,
Neville
Linda & Peter said,
June 23, 2010 @ 7:04 pm
Re Pilgrimage of Grace 1536
We have a map (internet source & sadly I have no record of its origin but from a student dissertation I think) which displays the changes to Spurn point and the islands in the Humber over time. Old Ravenser, Ravenser Spurn and Ravenser Odd are displayed with a time line of sorts. It’s more geography than history but the changes are dated.
I’m not sure it adds a great deal but I will email a copy of the map to the host of this site and perhaps he can share it with you.
As mentioned elsewhere on this site we are new to all of this and on a steep learning curve. I’m now off to find out more about the Lincolnshire Uprising.
Kind regards
Linda & Peter
neil henderson said,
July 3, 2010 @ 2:58 pm
Hello my name is neil henderson.i,m very intrested in the local history of the towns and county.I,ve been doing some studing myself and found some very intresting things onmy travels.I belive that once in our history we had a building so big it proberbly could have been some sort of cathedaral or a very large holy site.I would evern say a place of pilgrimige as far back as jesus times if not before.Not the main building it self but the place.I would evern say that this place evern would have been not wrote about in roman times because of its elegance.I have studied the stones that make up alot of the churches in the area as far as lincoln(cathedral) and have found that most are made from the same stone.
Lincoln cathedral you may say,the main rose window as you walk into the cathedral has the same outer fram as the church at waltham from the inside and the colums are the same as waltham too.Thay have the same windows but are all built at difrent times.So did the same maison build these? I belive that we had a main building that for some reason disapeard and that the remaining stone and windows,bells were used for other churches in our area and as far a feild as norwich,nottingham,york. .
There is documentation saying that parts of a building were sent to these three places and that we was getting taxed by other ciy,s eg lincoln and it realy does make me wonder weather the church have coverd up the tracks of what we had.For ower own good i may add,i think things were done for a reason.Did thay sell off what we had for there own churches and local amenaties .I would love to do a full scale dig at some places in Humberston and ask that we get help from national groups to do so.
I belive we have been robed of our culture and history for to long and we need get it back in some way.OK the buildings are no longer but we could build up the history of ower(city) we could have been as big as most city,s and evern been like a capital before lincoln fort was built by the romans.
If any one is intrested in doing something about what i have said i would be very intrested to hear from you.Lets make this happen and put the great back into grimsby and re build are local econamy.
Thanks for your time neil henderson.
Rod said,
July 3, 2010 @ 7:43 pm
Hi Neil,
thanks for the comment and welcome to the site.
Very interesting what you have to say - if you look at the first comment by Neville you’ll see an old map and the church marked on it is huge . . .
All the best
Rod
chris keyworth said,
July 3, 2010 @ 8:35 pm
what was i saying earlier rod about stone types and quarry locations
regards
chris
Rod said,
July 4, 2010 @ 8:14 am
I know Chris - spooky !
neil henderson said,
July 11, 2010 @ 4:29 pm
THANKS………..i,m just trying to find were the stone come from for this building.i visited lincoln cathedral last week and to my amazment there is a sign outside the first bit of the cathedral that has a mark the same as humberston.The windows in the first sectin of lincoln also are the same as walthem. The stone also lookes like boston and the pillers that are black marble are the same as lacby or north thorsby churches.My thort is that the stone was taken from the river,thus the reason why there is prehistoric shells in it and is of a sand stone efect,very crumberly.I belive that the stone at thortan is the same as well looking at the gate house. The arches that bare used aswell are of the same style and i belive that what we are looking at is some multi complex of religus or should i say worship buildings sited around humberston.Humberston being named after the stone dug from the humber t build such a complex.I fermily beleve that this would have been built way before any other place in the northern part of ower great country and was home to many a diffrent race.All diffrent nationalities if you like. This place is very important to this countries history ,with every saint being here at some time. I belive we were the capital place of england before lincoln,york and then london.Hidern away by the lovely chalk hils of the wolds,at some time may having horses or men carved out on them.I have more studie to do on the churches such as counting of windows,arches and later bells and also would like to see the vast land this place could see apon. Stow is my next port of call being what is said to be the oldest church around. If this has the same stone and arches then i will try and go ferther with my studies. Were the streets are pathed with gold could be this stone thst has been used because its very golden in colour and its had a plaster cover put over it.lime of some sort.WE have something here that could be very great for the local history of ower county ,but not very good for the history of places we now call are cities (capital),after all did the romans bring there building here or did thay take ower technics there.THANKS once again for your time i will get back to you soon. THE NEXT STEP IS GETTING PEOPLE TO MAP OUT THE LAND WERE I THINK THIS PLACE IS.this would regenerate if found our local economy putting us on the map and bring tourisam from all over the world to GREAT grimsby
neil henderson said,
July 11, 2010 @ 4:40 pm
just looked at the map rod aswell and if you look at the weather map on the tv it shows the elbow which is sited on your map, this could have been made from stone/rock dug from the river,its humberston were this church is on the map.I do belive that the river enterance wasnt were it is now and if so the humber flats(fitties )could have flooded at difrent times of year.with the enterance to the river being more near easinton.This would have explained the lost island out ther because the river doent flow true to a normal river.North sea lane and South sea lane are at humberston i think these name hold the key to the river operning.
chris keyworth said,
July 13, 2010 @ 11:52 am
Most of the Carving stone for the abbeys and Curches came from Ancaster south of Lincoln the building stone for most of the rural churches is from Nettlton area the lower grade building stone ie chalk was quarreyed local to the place it was being used Hence the hundreds of pits located all over the area and in every village..
Regards
Chris
MJD said,
August 18, 2010 @ 8:45 am
may be of interest - in the rear garden of 2 St Olafs Grove human remains were recovered when the anderson shelter was installed in the 1940`s MJD
Rod said,
August 18, 2010 @ 2:35 pm
MJD,
thanks for the commnet and welcome to the site - that is indeed of interest - many thanks for sharing it and I hope you return
All the best
Rod
Evelyn said,
September 9, 2010 @ 5:01 am
Re: Neville’s June 16th comment on inmates of Wellow. I have read that the Abbot - Whitgift - was the only one to receive a pension. At a lot of the monasteries if there were other larger houses of the same order that were not being closed at that time, the monks were given the choice of going to them or they could apply for a capacity.
Also the Robert mentioned in this post is Robert Hundleby born circa 1516 in the vicinity of Alford. He was ordained priest at the age of 18 yr. in December 1534, just after the Dean of Lincoln (George Heneage) and 72 others at the Cathdral had signed the Oath of Supremacy. Sir Thomas Heneage was his patron and presented him for the benefice of St. James Grimsby in 1551. He was instituted at Lambeth as the see at Lincoln was vacant at that time, Henry Holbeach having died and his successor not yet named. The Archdeacon of Lincoln was instructed to induct him. This involved laying the priest’s hands on the doors of the Church and the tolling of a bell. It is believed that Robert was dispossessed of the living in 1554 but he is found again at Scartho from 1558-1560 and then back at Grimsby in 1561. He died at Grimsby in 1591. Robert was twice indicted by the Mayor and Burgesses for playing football in the streets, once in 1589 when he would have been 73yrs. old! He is also mentioned in a bloody affray from 1564.
Question Neville or Rod or anyone - I am trying to write up the life and times of good ol’ Robert and wonder if you have any info on the population of Grimsby at this time? Also, would Robert be receiving the pension from Queen Bess because the Abbey paid a Curate before the Dissolution?
Cheers
Evelyn
Amiguru said,
September 9, 2010 @ 1:42 pm
Evelyn,
The nearest I can get to your timeframe is 1610 when the population was about 6000 according to an Architectural Societies Report.
“would Robert be receiving the pension from Queen Bess because the Abbey paid a Curate before the Dissolution?”
Can’t come up with a ready answer on this one but keep checking back - you never know - I’ll see what I can do.
Regards,
Neville
Evleyn said,
September 10, 2010 @ 8:34 am
Thanks Neville. This is such an interesting site and your knowledge/resources are phenomenal. I guess I should include Rod too, eh?
Cheers from Canada
Evelyn
Amiguru said,
September 10, 2010 @ 10:36 am
Evelyn,
I should always include Rod, indeed put him first as otherwise I might lose my status as Honorary Plenipotentiary!!!
Your welcome to the information as our whole ethos revolves around sharing what we know to the common good.
Regards,
Neville
evelyn said,
September 13, 2010 @ 9:01 pm
Neville:
I have just been reading in the records of the Corp of Great Grimsby that 23 Eliz. 1581 there is a dispute between the Corporation and George Heneage regarding some lands of Wellow Abbey. Evidently there is a map attached to these papers showing these disputed lands. Is this helpful? Evelyn
Derek Turner said,
September 23, 2010 @ 9:36 pm
Fascinating site, which I came across quite by chance. Good for you yo go to such trouble to keep alive the history and spirit of this part of Lincolnshire
Rod said,
September 24, 2010 @ 8:13 am
Hi Derek,
many thanks for the words of encouragement, much appreciated and welcome to the site.
There’s plenty more to come yet.
All the best
Rod
Amiguru said,
September 24, 2010 @ 4:27 pm
Evelyn,
Sorry for the late response to your comment - its so easy to miss something when the comments are coming thick and fast on various threads. That would I’m sure, be helpful to us, as Rod will confirm, I am a map fanatic as I believe they tell a great deal more than was intended when they were made. I am accumulating several other snippets about the abbey so when time allows….
Rod keeps triggering so many other interesting threads that it is a job to keep up with it all!
Regards,
Neville
Nick Dows said,
December 28, 2010 @ 12:49 am
I have the Grimsby Telegraph Bygones edition with the 1947 aerial photograph of the Abbey if anyone is interested? Not sure it would reproduce very well here but there must be a copy in the Grimsby Telegraph archives. It seems unbelievable today that a building like the Abbey was demolished as recently as 1967 considering it’s long history. What were they thinking?
Nick
Rod said,
December 28, 2010 @ 9:09 am
Nick,
I need to get onto that photograph and get a proper copy, as you say the grainy newspaper images don’t really replicate that well.
The building they pulled down was known as The Abbey I believe but was not the original building.
What a site that would have been to dig . . .
Best
Rod
Nick Dows said,
December 28, 2010 @ 11:41 am
Rod,
Bygones edition was June 1985, page 13. Might be a good starting point to get a copy?
Cheers, Nick
RButhnot said,
February 9, 2011 @ 11:12 am
Looking at the medieval map of the abbey, and in particular the nature of the building at J and the ‘crenellated’ feature… I know the orientation is a bit ‘off’ but could this be a gatehouse and some sort of walkway across a ditch, a la Thornton Abbey?
Rod said,
February 9, 2011 @ 4:35 pm
RB,
I don’t know but it’s a theory worth pursuing I’d hhave thought
Regards
Rod
Laurie said,
March 31, 2011 @ 6:06 pm
I was brought up as a child in Wellogate during the war. There was a building site which was abandonded at the start of the war in St Olafs Grove next to the Abbey. Before the Invasion of Normandy the American US Army occupied the Abbey, on of the Guardroom gates was on the St Olafs Grove site where we used to play. We used to pester the GIs for chewing gum and they were very friendly, missing their families. We used to fish in the Lake for roach, or at least the bigger boys did and I was sad because I had no fishing tackle. A GI took me up to his barrack room in the Abbey and made me a rod with a bent pin and some string and a bit of stick, we then sat on the edge of the lake and “fished” with no bait.Of course we caught nothing. The GI seemed happy just being there. There were rumours of a secret passage to St James Church or the Nunnery at Nuns Corner and a Well in the grounds which the GIs drained looking for the secret passage but all they found was a load of rubbish and a very big eel.
Then the British troops took over from the US Army when the GIs went to Normandy, the British troops security was much stricter but we still ran the gauntlet round the grounds. The best we got from ethe british troops was a drink of tea out of their pint mugs
Sorry this is not ancient history but its history of a kind.
Laurie
Rod said,
March 31, 2011 @ 6:27 pm
Laurie,
thanks for the tremendous comment and welcome to the site.
Sorry this is not ancient history but its history of a kind.
Far from it Laurie this is just the sort of stuff I love, what you’ve said is anecdotal and is not available anywhere else except in the mind of those who were there - now it’s preserved.
Stuff like the draining is like gold dust to me !
Thanks again Laurie
Regards
Rod
Andrew said,
May 28, 2011 @ 7:16 pm
In 1968 after the abbey/house had been knocked down, I found a skull in the area of the edge of the pond in front of #20 Abbey drive west, the contractors had dug a large hole (to bottom of the pond?). Grimsby police took the skull off me (I was only 10) and it later was recorded that it dated from 13th century.
Andrew
Rod said,
May 29, 2011 @ 7:32 am
Andrew,
many thanks indeed for the fascinating piece of information, really appreciated and welcome to the site
Kind regards
Rod
Martin said,
June 5, 2011 @ 5:29 pm
Excellent site! My wife and I are in the process of buying a house in Abbey Park Road so I have been reading this page with interest.
Does anyone know where I can get some “old” photographs of the area?I’d love to put up some pictures of area in bygone times around the house once we move in.
Best regards
Martin
Rod said,
June 5, 2011 @ 7:22 pm
Hi Martin,
many thanks indeed and welcome to the site.
Asking at the reference library in Grimsby could be a good place to start
Best
Rod
History Hunter said,
June 5, 2011 @ 9:45 pm
I can confirm multitudes of photos of the area are available for viewing in the Reference Library, including some of the later building called ‘The Abbey’. The Reference Library are, slowly, scanning every photo they have so they have a digital copy available, which i presume they would be able to enlarge should they be needed.
I have already mentioned what i saw on that visit if you care to look back on May 19th, 2010 on this thread.
John Paul said,
June 12, 2011 @ 10:57 pm
Just got on to this site purely by chance but a great read and am in awe at some of the knowledge shown by many of the contributors. I’m always fascinated by history whether it be local,national, or international and am getting into archaelogy more as well the older I get.
Just looking at various threads on this site and the Wellow Abbey one struck me as very interesting from a personal point of view.
One of my ancestors had owned the later “Abbey”, demolished in the 1960s,and I believe he lived there with various family members and several servants until his death.This was in the mid nineteenth century and I believe the house was purchased from the Wintringham family but I could be wrong.
Rod said,
June 13, 2011 @ 8:33 am
Hi John,
thanks for the comment and welcome to the site - pleased you find it of interest.
All the best,
Rod
Martin said,
June 19, 2011 @ 7:43 pm
Thanks Rod and HH. I’ll be sure to check the reference library as soon as I get moved in.
I’ll update you when I fund more.
Martin said,
June 25, 2011 @ 6:41 pm
Well I popped along to the reference library today to see if they had any pictures of my house but alas they did not, nor did they have any of the road. Tis a shame but I did find a picture of the first occupant of the house though, Not sure if I can past an image though but here goes:
[Edit: picture added]
Rod said,
June 26, 2011 @ 7:19 am
Mrtin,
many thanks indeed, do we know who it is ?
Best
Rod
Martin said,
June 26, 2011 @ 10:42 am
Rod
Thanks for adding the picture. Indeed I do know who he is; Anthony Bannister and he was the Mayor of Grimsby in 1903-4. I’ve asked the library for a copy of the photograph which I plan to get framed in a period frame (I saw lots at Hemswell Cliff RAF base - the place is full of antique shops).
It will be hung over the fireplace in the entrance hall to the house.
:-)
Martin
Martin said,
July 12, 2011 @ 8:25 pm
Well I am now sitting in the drawing room of my new home. Anthony Bannister, or at least his picture, has come home.
:-)
Rod said,
July 13, 2011 @ 6:45 am
Martin,
enjoy the new home, I hope it’s a happy one
Best
Rod
Dave Hitchborne said,
July 23, 2011 @ 10:35 am
Two many Kings in the second paragraph. Dave
Rod said,
July 23, 2011 @ 6:10 pm
Dave,
well spotted and welcome to the site
All the best
Rod
Tracy said,
September 26, 2011 @ 4:56 am
I still need to read through all the above comments but I am fairly certain my ancestor, Israel Bartram, lived on the land of Abby Farm, Wellow. There is a record in the Lincolnshire archives where May 1729 Christopher Clayton was to lease for 7 years, to Mr. Bartram, Abbey Farme, Wellow. Also, in The History of Grimsby by Edward Gillett, there is a passage that says “Israel Bartram, of the Nuns’ Farm, claimed the beaconage-toll which the priory had enjoyed before the Reformation, and tried to assert his rights by taking timber from one of Clayton’s keels.” So is Nun’s Farm the same as Abby Farm at Wellow or are they fairly close to each other? I can’t help but wonder if the picture Neville posted above was on the spot of or even part of my ancestor’s home.
Tracy
Rod said,
September 26, 2011 @ 8:11 am
Tracy,
I would presume them to be two different ‘farms’ if their names refer directly to their locations which I’d presume they do.
Regards
Rod
Templar said,
December 1, 2011 @ 10:25 pm
I did extensive research on Wellow Abbey when at Nottingham University (Advanced Cert in Local History) then updated info in the sites and monument records at GY archaeology. I also taught Local History in Gy
Most informative are the Bishops visitations. It was a very poor abbey with few monks. All my copious notes are in the attic somewhere.
The Wintringhams owned the Abbey and the Weelsby Wood lions stood either side of the door. If you walk the area of new houses you will see quite a bit of rubble and worked stone in gardens. There are bits in St James church..memory..hmm chapter dial?
The Hazlington tomb is in St James and came from St Leonards.
On the map I believe the right hand side building to be Humberstone Abbey as Old Clee had sea up to it. (we did a dig there a few years ago) and I recorded Humberstone site.
Information Sites and Monuments records, Lincoln Archives, Lincoln cathedral. Rolls, Lincoln ref Library (Local History), Grimsby archives, Library , RAFA records, Newspapers (library) etc Any use?