Knights Templar Preceptory in Grimsby Lincolnshire ?
Was there a Knights Templar Preceptory located in Grimsby and was it one the site of a House of Hospitallers of St John of Jerusalem ?
This is, obviously, of great interest and I should like to take credit for the research but it comes from Neville Sisson and was originally a comment but I deemed it too important and interesting so here it is.
I hand you over now, with gratitude, to Neville Sisson. Any ideas, opinions, comments and information would be very much appreciated - so please do leave a comment should you wish - thank you. Over to Neville . . .
The map shows the area now familiarly known as Nun’s Corner or should that be Nuns’ Corner? Thought I’d get that in before anyone starts nit-picking.
Dr. George Oliver in his essay ‘The Monumental Antiquities of Great Grimsby’, 1825, states on page 111 that the House of Hospitallers of St John of Jerusalem
was believed to be built on one of the hills adjoining the nunnery, (which, incidentally, was endowed with the patronage of Littlecoates Church, featured in another of Rod’s threads,). He elaborates that the hill was near the Fosse Way and the Grimsby Corporation records state that it was beyond Bargate. It should be noted that in the map shown above North is roughly at 4 o’clock and the road coming in from that direction is the modern A1243 known as Bargate. The road labelled above as ‘Fosse Way’ * is the current A1243 Scartho Road. The embankment in the image going off in the direction of 2 o’clock is the modern A46 Laceby Road.
* Either the drawer of the map labelled Scartho Road wrongly as ‘Fosse Way’ or in those times it was in fact the better route to the the ancient way via a more circuitous route. Currently the Fosse Way connects to the A46 coming from Laceby.
The embanked road ends abruptly at the hill marked ‘C’ and I would suggest that this is the hill upon which the Hospital was built. Oliver suggests that the hospital was founded by one of the abbots of Wellow, the prioress of St Leonards Nunnery and the merchants of Grimsby. He then states that it was originally . . .
A preceptory of the Knights Templars and was established during King John’s reign. More of the Knights Templar involvement later.
The second point supporting my theory can be demonstrated using the above map in conjunction with Google Maps. If in later times there was a need to link Bargate with the Laceby Road and the Hospital, or its ruins, on hill ‘C’ was in the way it would be natural then to make the connecting bit of road skirt round the hill as was often done when obstacles intervened and travel was by foot or hoof.
Looking at the modern road layout this could explain why Laceby Road, after it passes The Grimsby Institute of Further Education, veers slightly north then gets back on course again after Second Avenue. It is on this basis that I suggest that hill ‘C’ and the ‘Hospital’ were roughly the area encircled by Milton Road, Second Avenue and Byron Grove.
Regards,
N 
le
[edit - Neville]
To continue by stepping further back in time, continuing to talk of the Knights Templars Preceptory the Dr states:
The house and the site on which it stood were the gift of Robert de Bassingburne;* and at the dissulution of the Order, its revenues were given to the Knights Hospitallers of St. John, and it was placed under the jurisdiction of the mayor and burgesses of Grimsby.
* Hundred Rolls, Tower [of London]
[edit - Rod]
The Abbot of Wellow built a wall across the high road leading into the town, as did also the prioress of St.Leonard’s nunnery, and the master and brothers of the Knight’s Templars.
Further to that the ‘military ecclesiastics’ are also said to have taken a windmilll which was owned by the corporation and part of a fee farm.
They refused to pay fees ordered by the courts and “even went as far as to set up their own court” which dealt with anything which arose “within their precients”
[Edit - Rod]
c 1250 Alan le Aumener (also called Alan of Bassingburn) granted the Knights Templar land in Grimsby to the value of £4.15s 0 1/2d p.a. By virtue of this grant they claimed a right to hold a court in the borough, to have the burgesses grind their corn exclusively at their windmill.
[Edit Rod 16.7.10]
Tax records dated 1492 relating to revenues from Grimsby Fee farms mentions 3 lots of mills.
Mill of Alice de Sixill
Kings Mills
Mill of the Templars
Clearly 1492 post dates the Knights Templar but the reference clearly indicates not only did they own said mill but it continued to be referred to as such.
The anticipated revenue to the borough was only 4 shillings for the year
Rod said,
December 15, 2009 @ 8:17 pm
Neville,
this is belting stuff.
He then states that it was originally a preceptory of Knights Templars and was established during King John’s reign
I’ve always felt that there had to be great Knights Templar activity in and around Grimsby than is, information wise, immediately to hand.
This really does warrant looking into, fantastic stuff
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
December 15, 2009 @ 8:37 pm
Rod,
You are too kind, thankyou. A first reflection for me is that the oldest buildings of the College of Technology, as it was known when I was there, (1958/9 full time then in 5 subsequent years on day release, and again in 1968,) was built just about slap bang on top of Hill ‘A’!
Regards,
le
N
Amiguru said,
December 15, 2009 @ 9:56 pm
Chris,
This St. Leonards Priory was the name-giver of Nuns’ Corner. Whether it was situated on hill ‘A’ or hill ‘B’ is where I am at now. It was mentioned in a bulla of Pope Lucius III dated 1185. Here is an extract: ….monialium Sci Leonardi de Grymesbi ad nos transmiss. accepim. quod enim From Sci Augustini de Grymesbi,….. *
* Harleian Collection, Brit. Mus.
Dr. Oliver states that it was situated “ ….on a pleasant and healthy eminence, which still retains its name, at the junction of two principal roads leading into the town……It contained only a prioress and seven nuns….”
Regards,
le
N
chris keyworth said,
December 16, 2009 @ 12:10 am
NUNS HILLS.
At this station are three hills, in immediate connection with each other. The hill marked A on the plan, is known by the name of Chapel Hill, and was the site of a Benedictine Nunnery; that marked B, is called Spittal Hill, and on it was erected a House of Hospitallers of St. John of Jerusalem; and the hill marked C, is designated Mill Hill, from the use to which it was assigned when the true religion had expelled the rites of Druidism from its precincts; for by a statute of St. Benedict, every religious house of this order was obliged to provide itself with a mill upon its own premises. These three consecrated hills are situated at equal distances, and form an equilateral triangle
(The monumental antiquities of Great Grimsby George Oliver)
You should have known given a choice of A,B or C. I would go for D, Pease Nev don’t take offence if I pick things apart, its how i get to the bottom of problems I am quite badly Dyslexic but it has taught me to think differently about things and I think may way around things rather than going for the obvious, I have been told it is thinking in a 3D mind, it works… no offence intended mate…
regards
chris
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 8:14 am
Neville,
I too spent a hour at the college and another 4 day release and night class - little did I know what I was walking on - far more interesting than the courses I did
What I find most interesting about this very interesting theory you’ve put together is the off-hand way in which Dr. George Oliver mentions the Templar Preceptory, no big fuss, just drops it in !
That gives real credence to it for me.
I have to say I’ve looked at the hills before as they always come up with Grimsby history but I ended up not knowing whether i was on foot or horseback with it all - it gets very confusing - well to me at least
It’s so difficult to get info re the Knights Templar but I want to press ahead on the the basis that you’re right and there was a preceptory here - there must be another piece of the puzzle somewhere that fits in and gives another connection.
I was always sure there had to be some more Templar history to GY Neville and I think this is it !
Best
Rod
Femme Fatale said,
December 16, 2009 @ 12:49 pm
Rod,
This should keep all three of you busy during winter
Very interesting read, thank you.
FF
xx
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 12:59 pm
FF,
it’s keeping me busy now
I’ve got maps on the floor and my head is spinning with it, Neville’s landed a big fish here I think.
With a solid reference to a Preceptory about which I knew nothing about - I want to run with that aspect of it, that’s the key thing.
Best
Rod
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 3:15 pm
Quote snippets from info emailed in - many thanks Steve - fabulous !
Bargate, already existed in the 13th century. In 1389 it was orderd that John Pervant shouyld produce before the mayor the bell belonging to the Leper Hospital which his wife had given to the abbey.
There was a chapel there to which the bell belonged.
**********
against John Yooke, a hermit, and she appeared personally in court and every year on the feast of St Mary of Magdalene the mayor and burgesses went to the hospital for games of wrestling and the keeper had to provide four gallons of all.
They are great snippets ! Mary Magdalene is a very strong connection with the Knights Templar.
Whenever they are about you’ll see St John the Baptist and Mary Magdalene.
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
December 16, 2009 @ 5:19 pm
Rod,
Steve’s snippets all fit perfectly. To quote Dr. Oliver, himself quoting Court Records, “ 6th February, 15 Edward IV, (1475) ‘The office of Procurator of the Hospital of the blessed Mary Magdalene, without the Bars of Grimsby,………were granted to William Cross, for the term of his life,rendering to the King…….and to the Mayor for the time being, at the feast of the blessed Mary Magdalene, xiid. in money, and one pot of ale containing four flaggons, with competent bread and cheese, as had of old been accustomed.’ ”
To continue by stepping further back in time, continuing to talk of the Knights Templars Preceptory the Dr states: The house and the site on which it stood were the gift of Robert de Bassingburne;* and at the dissulution of the Order, its revenues were given to the Knights Hospitallers of St. John, and it was placed under the jurisdiction of the mayor and burgesses of Grimsby.
* Hundred Rolls, Tower [of London]
This is on a roll, (sorry), now isn’t it Rod? Epitomy of episodal history.
Regards,
le
N
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 5:48 pm
Neville,
crikey !!!!
that is simply fantastic - can’t tell you !
This puts some real meat on the bones Neville, I have to look for more info and leave another comment
Cracking Gromit !
Rod
Amiguru said,
December 16, 2009 @ 5:53 pm
Chris,
No offence taken. Anything I state or quote is given with a great deal of care, cross-checking and self interrogation. Mistakes will naturally be made but I try to eliminate them if it is my doing. Some references are now available via the web and of course, that is not a bad thing as it enables others to cross check and correct where necessary. I have quite large collection of antiquarian books on Lincolnshire as well as some less available maps, so most of my material comes from them.
I try to be as accurate as possible as history is already embroidered by those who have gone before. Another ploy I tend to use through the courtesy of Sir Rod’s magnificent site, is to break stories and information into chunks which makes it less boring for the casual reader. That is why some of what I say may seem to be incomplete.
Regards,
le
N
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 5:53 pm
I’d like to concentrate this thread on any and all possible Knight Templar connections, people, buildings, land the area anything at all.
I should prefer, if people don’t mind, to move the hill issue to one side so as not to detract.
I think each hilll should in fact be the subject of an later and individual post so we can explore the different possibilities there and perhaps get all the info known in separate posts thereby making it easier to follow and also to avoid losing really important bits of information in different posts
Hope that’s OK and that it makes sense to others and not just me
I’m off on the templar Trail (thanks for another day and evening gone Neville
)
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 6:02 pm
Neville,
Robert de Bassingburn, listed as connected to a church in 1235 . . . in light of one of my comments above guess the name . . .
St John the Baptist !!
This really is stacking up !
Femme Fatale said,
December 16, 2009 @ 6:38 pm
Rod,
Although I am finding all of this very very interesting and learning something new about the local area, I was wondering what a Preceptory was and what was its purpose?
Many thanks
FF
xx
Rod said,
December 16, 2009 @ 7:09 pm
FF,
a good question and one doubt a few people reading this asked themselves, (note to myself).
It is a sort of headquarters from which knights of religious orders would run their estates and general business - a head office if you will.
There are a few listed in Lincolnshire, such as Temple Bruer but none mentioned in Grimsby !!
Thanks for that FF a timely question
Best
Rod
chris keyworth said,
December 16, 2009 @ 9:31 pm
right now we have the evidential location sorted out lets see what if anything we can find out about the preceptory and the land it is conected too.
regards
chris
Steve... said,
December 16, 2009 @ 10:00 pm
Lots of references to land ownership in Grimsby…
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=67070
33 Hen. VI. 1454, Oct. 24.—Copy letter from Robert Bovill, Prior of the Hospital of St. John of Jerusalem in England, dated at Clerkenwell, as to William Asseby of Grymesby, a tenant of the said Hospital, as of the Preceptory of Wylughton, co. Lincoln. (fo. 10.)
chris keyworth said,
December 16, 2009 @ 10:00 pm
I susspect that the name of this Preceptory is St Ledgers as many of the St Ledger familys fought in the Crusades..
Femme Fatale said,
December 17, 2009 @ 8:45 am
Rod,
Thank you for that,
it makes a bit more sense to me now
FF
xx
Rod said,
December 18, 2009 @ 3:21 pm
Robert de Bassingbourne
further information:
Had a son Allan
there is also a Joan de Bassingbourne with Axholme Lincolnshire connections, died c 1272
Rod said,
December 18, 2009 @ 3:30 pm
Templar Reference:
The Abbot of Wellow built a wall across the high road leading into the town, as did also the prioress of St.Leonard’s nunnery, and the master and brothers of the Knight’s Templars.
Further to that the ‘military ecclesiastics’ are also siad to have taken a windmilll which was owned by the corporation and part of a fee farm.
They refused to pay fees ordered by the courts and “even went as far as to set up their own court” which dealt with anything which arose “within their precients”
This action meant they were in effect declaring themselves free of the authority of the local Abbey and of the King.
Which they were as they were only answerable to the Pope.
This action in Grimsby caused
“opposition on the part of the burgesses, who entered into a league to resist them to the utmost”
Amiguru said,
December 18, 2009 @ 4:31 pm
Good going Rod!
Perhaps, “.built a wall across the high road…….as did also the prioress of St.Leonard’s nunnery, and the master and brothers of the Knight’s Templars.” indicates why there are embankments in the above plan.
Effectively it would become a kind of gate, barring entry to the unwelcome, ergo, Bargate ???
As to “ What are the best names for the hills on the above map ? did you mean collectively, in which case why not ‘The Nuns Hills’. Individually I am fairly certain, (due to a little more info today,) that Hill A was the Nunnery Hill, B and C still have some mutual ambiguity for me although I have a reason to think, (also due to a little more info today,) that Hill B is Mill Hill. Therefore I would suggest Spittall Hill for C.
Regards,
le
N
Rod said,
December 18, 2009 @ 5:02 pm
Neville,
I thought the info on the windmill and the court was very important as well, they’re clearly suggestive of a reasonable sized presence not only in the town but that area !
I knew the Hill names was going to be a nightmare
I wanted to do posts for each hill so as to avoid confusion, therefore nailing the names is the obvious place to start - helps with a title for each post if nothing else
I agree with Nuns’ Hills as a collective term
Cheers
Rod
Amiguru said,
December 18, 2009 @ 5:04 pm
Rod,
Re:
“Are we happy with ?
A=Chapel
B=Spittal
C= Mill
As I said above I would at the moment opt for B=Mill, C=Spittal.
Reason: There is a drawing by George Skelton entitled and showing ‘Old House Bargate 1800′ with significantly, a windmill in the distance and it is to the left of the road.
Bargate 1800 - Note Windmill
Of course, there is no guaranteeing that it is on the site of the mill referred to in the Saga of the Hills but how many mills were there likely to be in Bargate et environs? I will add it to my next scanning session and let you have it.
Regards,
le
N
Rod said,
December 18, 2009 @ 6:03 pm
Neville
liking the windmill
Right the hills, I just took my suggestion from monumental antiq’ . . .
I’ll go with the names, that way I can write a basic post for each one then ste about locations on each thread.
I must say I’m keen on your investiagtive route rather than just going by a single reference source which i sas likely wrong as right !
Best
Rod
Steve... said,
December 20, 2009 @ 10:34 am
Just sent copy of a 1695 parchment showing the main route from Nottingham to Grimsby; it runs along Scartho Road and not Laceby Road. So the map marked ‘Fosse Way’ is correct!
Amiguru said,
December 20, 2009 @ 11:10 am
Well done Steve, it’s just that the question needed asking.
Regards,
le
N
Rod said,
December 21, 2009 @ 12:48 pm
Update,
see latest edit in original article
Rod said,
December 21, 2009 @ 5:03 pm
1695 parchment map added to Steve’s comment, roll upward - many thanks for sending it in Steve
All the best
Rod
Rod said,
December 24, 2009 @ 9:28 am
Robert de Bassingburne - more info
post 1217 I believe,
The demesne of Grimsby with its pastures and meadows were granted to Robert de Bassingburne but he still had to pay an annual rent for it to the borough fee farm
Amiguru said,
March 21, 2010 @ 10:41 am
Rod,
Just thought you might like this little titbit for your Sunday treat. Its from the Calendar of Patent Rolls tempus Edward I, 6 May 1305
“Licence for the alienation in mortmain by Robert le Eyr of Grimesby, to the master and brethren of the Knights Templars in England, of 40d. rent from a tenement of his in the town of Grimesby, so that a place there of the guardian and Friars Minors of Grimesby may be discharged of a like rent to the said Knights Templars”
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
March 21, 2010 @ 3:06 pm
Neville,
that’s a cracking find - I’v enot read that specifically before.
That must refer to the fact that the Grey Friars originally paid rent to the Templars in Grimsby.
It’s great see the full reference Neville, I allude to the theory here but that well and truly nails it down !
You’re having quite a day Neville !
Best
Rod
Amiguru said,
May 5, 2010 @ 12:51 pm
Sir Rodders,
Hope you will forgive this little bit of promotion but it might have a slight significance for us:
National Geographic HD, 8pm, Monday 10th. May 2010….
‘Knights Templar on Trial’ !
Hope you can watch it
Neville
Rod said,
May 5, 2010 @ 5:52 pm
Neville,
I’ve got loads of channels now - but not that one
It’s always difficult to know what channels I do have but there seems to be a rule of thumb - once in a blue moon when a potentially interesting things is to be aired on TV I can be assured it’s on a channel I don’t get !
Hopefully others will get to see it
Cheers
Rod the Televisual Peasant
Amiguru said,
May 5, 2010 @ 6:42 pm
Rod,
I don’t as a rule watch TV so I am in an even more frugal position…just the basic 5 analogues. My window on the world is the web. But, I have lots of channels available on the net. I use Zatoo and TVUnetworks with hundreds of choices from all around the world. I have just installed Ziggytv as it does the above channel but haven’t tried it out properly yet. I’ll let you know how it works out.
Regards,
Neville
Rod said,
July 16, 2010 @ 7:57 pm
Update edit to original article re mills
BTW I still get emails saying the Knights Templar were not in Grimsby - I think we’ve firmly esatblished that they were now
Jolland DE said,
January 1, 2011 @ 11:20 am
The warden and brethren of the order of Friars Minors in Grimsby to retain land adjoining their house in Grimsby acquired by them from Elias le Pescur, who retains land and rent there. Lincoln . Inquisitions taken as a result of applications to the Crown
Date: 1312 - 1313
What is the Order of Friars??
Rod said,
January 1, 2011 @ 3:14 pm
Jolland,
that would, I believe, be the Grey Friars - as they were originally on Templar held land.
Best
Rod
temp said,
November 15, 2011 @ 7:42 pm
dear rod,well for some unknown reason i have always been drawn towards the templars,i cant understand why?i feel like this.i have been reading the things you have been writing and find it very interesting and yet not surprised?i know this would sound a bit silly and i know your not psychic or are you?lol but i just cant help feel drawn towards this.any ideas?it would be grateful.im 46 i work have 2 beautiful boys but yet the templars have always been in the forefront of my thoughts.im not crackers and strongly believe there is something im looking for in the templars,if you can help it would be very appreciated as i need to take this a next step
many thanks
Rod said,
November 15, 2011 @ 7:47 pm
Temp,
I think people have always be drawn towards the Templars, so much so it’s worth remembering that a huge part of their massive wealth, and how they actually financed themselves initially, was from huge donations and the fact the some very rich and powerful men gave the order all their land and money when they joined and swapped luxury for hardship and often death !
If you wanted to get a more realistic idea of things as opposed to the potted versions in popular books and depicted on movies then a serious book is the best bet I think.
You may well already have read it but Malcolm Barber’s The New Knighthood paints a more realistic view of things - it’s ‘dry’ and scholarly but worth the time if you’re keen.
Cheers
Rod